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Posted by Smarty on 08/14/07 13:39
I just wanted to add that my own experience with the Canon HV20 is very
similar to Mark's, and this is quite an amazing little camera. Since I have
purchased it, the FX1 and HC3 have been sold, and the weddings I have done
with the HV20 look better, sound better, and are superior in virtually all
respects. Amazing considering that the HV20 is now sold below $900 and was
only $1200 when I bought it.
Smarty
"Mark & Mary Ann Weiss" <mweissX294@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:4kbwi.192035$hS7.81682@fe04.news.easynews.com...
>> The US model also suffers progressive scan image problems although the
>> over-sharpening artefacts are much reduced from the V1E model. Just
>> compare a locked off 60i image to either 24P or 30p and make sure you
>> look at the dark areas of the image and areas of similar colour will be
>> lacking detail and macroblocked compared with 60i. You will also see
>> much more mosquito noise round contrasty fine detail in progressive mode
>> compared to interlace.
>
> This is interesting. I already found out that the 60i mode has less noise
> for a given gain up setting. Now your additional information will be
> material that I will try experimenting with, to see how much difference.
> The
> noise difference is about 3dB.
>
>
>> Some time later I purchased the Canon XH-A1 and I am delighted with the
>> way its encoder handles motion in both 25F and 50i. Resolution tests
>> might put the V1e 50 lines more res vertically but as soon as the image
>> moves the Canon image hold up to some very close scrutiny where the Sony
>> fails immediately.
>
> I recently bought a Canon HV20, and I am embarassed to say that both the
> picture AND sound are VASTLY superior to the V1U. The CODEC seems to be
> MUCH
> less plagued with artifacts. In fact, some stills I pulled from my HV20,
> run
> through PhotoShop with levels set to exaggerate the macroblocks on a blue
> sky scene showed much smaller and less obvious types of macroblock
> artifacts. The V1U footage has such extreme macroblock artifacts that I am
> noticing them on blue sky footage and on flat, still water in a shot
> looking
> down on a river's edge where the water is stagnent. Flat green color, but
> pronounced rectangular stepping of colors there.
> Some footage of people's faces looks like a Solarizing filter was applied.
> It's awful.
>
> I shot some footage with my HV20, which I purchased as a B roll camera for
> the 2 V1Us, and the only real deficiency with it is that the picture has
> too
> much contrast. Cinema mode helps, but applies a blurring effect to the
> whole
> picture, making it look slightly soft. Normal mode has crisp, sharp edges,
> hardly any chromatic aberration, and amazingly good color fidelity for a
> one-chipper.
>
> I recorded a wedding last month, using the HV20 for the altar mic feed. I
> also fed the V1U as a backup. When I listened to those two versions, and
> also my Zoom H4 version, which was recording the choir/organ performance,
> I
> was stunned at just how bad the V1U audio was, and how good the HV20 audio
> was. This is all upside-down! More expensive should not mean worse sound &
> picture!
>
>
>> The HVR-V1 has received glowing reviews but this is a reflection of the
>> competence of the person reviewing the camera rather than the camera
>> itself. There seems to be a cadre of pseudo intellectuals making
>> pronouncements about a subject they demonstrably know very little about.
>> I know people who have been banned from web fora for voicing those
>> opinions.
>
> ========================================================================
> The problem here can be traced to one individual. He is a Sundance media
> fellow and part of VASST. One should trace the money/funding. I think that
> explains that gentleman's blind eye and deaf ear to the bad sound and
> picture on the V1U. This gentleman has implied on public forums that I am
> a
> quack and have an agenda to harm Sony. He is doing a grave disservice to
> the
> video community by suppressing my views and using his clout and reputation
> to discredit my scientific tests of camera audio. My testing and making
> public of this problem should be welcomed, as it opens the door to a
> possible Sony recall and we all benefit. Wouldn't everyone who owns a V1U
> rather have the full audio frequency response, rather than what it is now?
> DSE seems to think otherwise.
> ========================================================================
>
> In all fairness, I think what Sony accomplished with 1/4" chips is nothing
> short of amazing, however, it should be a CONSUMER camera, not an ENG
> camera. HD needs 6X the chip surface area as SD to obtain the same light
> sensitivity. Going down in chip size just aggravates the CODEC. And Sony's
> CODEC is clearly inferior to Canon's. I would have bought the XL-H1,
> except
> that all the footage I found shot with that camera suffers the worst
> chromatic aberration I've ever seen in a semi-pro camera. The HV20 is
> actually better than both the XL-H1 and the V1U. Amazing little camera.
>
>
>> Avoid the HVR-V1 unless you are only interested in interlaced recording.
>>
>> To now hear that the V1 has crappy audio does not surprise me. I didn't
>> get that far as the image it captured was a joke.
>>
>> S
>
> I'm continuing to pound on Sony technical support in New Jersey, but
> getting
> nowhere so far. New V1Us for sale are being listed with "20-20Khz"
> frequency
> response. Buyers of those cameras beware. But at least now we have a means
> to nail Sony on false advertising, if those cameras now shipping are the
> same as the ones that shipped before July 2007.
>
> Yes, the images can be very poor. But don't tell the folks on DVinfo.net.
> They're all kissing Sony's arse over there. Anyone who speaks a bit of
> truth
> gets talked down by DSE. The fact is, the picture is garbage in low light.
> There are rare instances where the picture is quite good. These are almost
> always daylight scenes, with simple backgrounds and no gradient or
> near-flat
> colors (which show concentric bands, like rings on a tree trunk). I can't
> stop being distracted by that banding, every time I look at HDV footage
> from
> the V1U. It's way more distracting than any DV artifacts I saw on my
> VX2000.
>
>
>
> --
>
>
> Take care,
>
>
>
> Mark & Mary Ann Weiss
>
>
>
> VIDEO PRODUCTION . FILM SCANNING . DVD MASTERING . AUDIO RESTORATION
> Hear my Kurzweil Creations at: www.dv-clips.com/theater.htm
> www.basspig.com The Bass Pig's Lair - 15,000 Watts of Driving Stereo!
> Business sites at:
> www.mwcomms.com
> www.adventuresinanimemusic.com
> -
>
>
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