Posted by Terry Pinnell on 12/24/83 11:28

Frank <frank@nojunkmail.humanvalues.net> wrote:

>On Wed, 05 Oct 2005 14:08:55 +0100, in 'rec.video.desktop',
>in article <Re: Cannot erase DVD-RW>,
>Terry Pinnell <terrypin@dial.pipex.com> wrote:
>
>
>>>I hope that Terry reads this, because it may just be what's happening
>>>to him, although I'd still like to see the results of an IsoBuster
>>>Surface Scan.
>>
>>Yes, still reading every reply I get studiously thanks Frank!
>>
>>I only got around to doing the first surface scan this morning (it's
>>lunchtime here now) as I was unsure which of my 10 DVD-RW discs would
>>be the best initial candidate. I chose #9, which was unplayable on
>>both lounge DVD player and PC with PowerDVD. Nero Info says "Open. Not
>>finalized." At the end of the (long) scan I got this:
>>---------
>>[DVD-RW:RITEK000V11A]
>>
>>Number of errors encountered on the disc : 2297888
>
>In my opinion, this disc looks like a candidate for the trash can,
>sorry to say, although I don't use packet writing (Nero InCD).
>
>>This is a packet written disc. Errors are not abnormal on this disc.
>>To see if files are affected, look for the 'error' icon next to files
>>or :
>>Select a File System of your choice and select :
>>
>>List files with read errors (in Edit Window)
>>---------
>>
>>I don't see how to do implement that last instruction? Can't see an
>>'Edit' window anywhere...
>
>I know, it's a little confusing. Also, I'm using a registered paid
>version of the program and you are, I assume, using the unregistered
>free version and I'm not certain of all of the differences between the
>two, but I believe that if you go in to view individual sectors on the
>disc, that's the "Edit Window" to which the message is referring.
>
>>(Mind you, not sure 2.3M errors would make
>>pleasant reading!)
>
>Maybe I've just been lucky, but I've *never* encountered a disc with
>that number of errors, ever.
>
>>The IsoBuster Help says
>>"The list with erroneous files can always be recreated without the
>>necessity to redo the scan. Just select the File System icon and
>>create the list via 'Directory tree and file information' "
>>But how do I reach that? All I see in the left pane (when expanded)
>>is:
>>DVD-RW
>> Open Session 1
>> Track 01
>
>It's talking, I believe, about the program's ability to save the error
>list as a text file on your hard disk for possible future reference,
>thus avoiding the need to re-scan the disc again in the future.
>Personally, I'm willing to take the extra time and let it re-scan, so
>I never save the information.
>
>>So where is 'Directory tree and file information' please?
>
>Try right-clicking on *everything* in the user interface. IsoBuster is
>one of those programs which just loves the right mouse button, so much
>so, in fact, that if I spend some time in IsoBuster and then switch to
>another, more conventionally-written application, I have to
>consciously remind myself that right-clicking on anything in sight
>won't necessarily bring up a context menu. :)
>
>>Anyway, is that huge number of errors the likely cause of my problems
>>with that *particular* disc?
>
>I would be inclined to believe that, yes. It's not impossible, you
>know, that you were simply unfortunate enough to get a bad batch of
>discs--or even ones which simply don't play well with your particular
>drive and/or your drive's firmware level. In fact, it might be useful
>to Google your drive's make and model and see if any firmware updates
>are available for it. It certainly wouldn't be the first time that a
>firmware update has fixed problems like this.
>
>>Does this tell me anything about *how*
>>these errors got onto the disc?
>
>Not that I can see, no, but I don't claim to be a DVD-RW burning
>expert, either.
>
>>Of course, I wasn't being as
>>methodical 2 days ago as I'm trying to be now, but I *think* all I did
>>on it was use Nero Express to 'Erase disc'.
>>
>>Although it ties up the drive for so long, maybe I should now do
>>another surface scan with a 'good' identical disc?
>
>I would definitely do that, yes. Personally, for important work, I do
>an IsoBuster Surface Scan right after I burn a disc.
>
>>>I would also suggest to Terry that he disable any active anti-virus
>>>software that may be running in the background on his system, at least
>>>when he's burning DVDs. He can always re-enable it when he's done
>>>burning. This is in addition to the recommendation that I made
>>>previously with regard to disabling of InCD at system startup,
>>>assuming that he's not doing any packet writing.
>>
>>Thanks, have now done both those before further tests.
>
>As long as you can trust yourself to always remember to re-enable the
>anti-virus software afterwards, I would recommend that you always
>disable it prior to working with any video-related projects.
>
>>>I'm also, based upon his latest posts, wondering whether he's burning
>>>his DVD-RW discs in DVD-ROM (data) format or DVD-Video format.
>>
>>This is a murky area for me, so please bear with me! I've been doing
>>*both*, and perhaps that's causing or at least contributing to my
>>problems? Basically, I've been repeating operations from a very
>>limited repertoire:
>>
>>1. In Nero Express: Erase disc.
>>That doesn't ask me what is on the disc, what I want to do with it, or
>>anything else. I'm assuming it should simply do what it says on the
>>can: ERASE everything, so that I have an empty, spanking new DVD-RW to
>>work on?
>>
>>2. In Nero Express: Burn a single data file.
>>This was chosen for maximum speed and simplicity
>>
>>3. In my DVD 'authoring' program, MemoriesOnTV: Either create a video
>>and store it on HD (VOB etc), or do that and also burn it to DVD.
>>That was the source of the content on most of the DVD-RWs I tried to
>>Erase. In fact, on first trying to burn from MoT onto an existing
>>video, there is always a message asking if I want to erase the disc
>>first. Every time I did so on those I tried, it failed and aborted.
>>That's why I turned to Nero Express to erase - and that failed too.
>>One other complication I'll mention in case it's relevant is that Mot
>>offers an option on burning to 'Use Nero Drivers'. I'm unable to be
>>sure for all discs which did use that. I can say that the last couple
>>I did for tests (just making a 'movie' from a single JPG) were with
>>the proprietary MoT drivers.
>
>In my opinion, it's *really* important to choose the correct sort of
>formatting when working with any recordable (-R or +R) or re-writable
>(-RW or +RW) optical media. If you were burning a CD-R disc, for
>example, the two most commonly used formats would be as a data
>(CD-ROM) disc or as a Redbook audio CD (CDDA). There's a world of
>difference between the two formats. With burnable DVD formats, you
>have similar choices to make.
>
>Burn in DVD-Video format, for example, if your intent is to create a
>disc which is to be played back in a televison-set-attached DVD player
>(in which case you'll need to have authored the disc prior to burning
>it and the disc will have a VIDEO_TS folder containing .vob and other
>special file types). Burn in DVD-ROM (data) format when you simply
>want to put files, of whatever type (.avi, .mpg, .wav, .mp3, .pdf,
>.doc. gif, .jpg, .txt, etc.), on the disc for use in a
>computer-attached DVD drive.
>
>Maybe it will help to think of the DVD-Video formatted disc as the
>video equivalent of a Redbook audio CD and the DVD-ROM data-formatted
>DVD disc as the functional equivalent (but with greater storage
>capacity) of the CD-ROM disc.
>
>And let's not even mention the -VR and +VR formats, please, where you
>can perform limited re-authoring of the disc, or the DVD-Audio or SACD
>formats with LPCM or DSD encoded to MLP. Or those little mini-discs
>used in some low-end consumer camcorders which sometimes record MPEG-2
>and sometimes, I believe, record some flavor of MPEG-4 video. Then
>there's single layer and double (dual) layer and single-sided and
>double-sided. Then we have the different file systems used on DVDs --
>ISO 9660 and UDF, the latter of which comes in multiple versions.
>Let's not forget DVD-RAM. And then there's single session versus
>multi-session, the latter of which is what you want to use on
>re-writable DVD media when you plan to came along later and add to or
>delete from an existing compilation or erase and start over with a new
>compilation.
>
>And whatever happened to DVD-18 discs? If they were ever widely used,
>we wouldn't need HD DVD discs or Blu-ray Discs (BD) to store high-def
>video content, assuming MPEG-4 Part 10 AVC H.264 (or VC-1) encoding.
>
>(Sorry for the rambling.)
>
>A review of the DVD Demystified DVD FAQ should help - just be sure to
>set aside an evening to digest all of the information. :)
>
>DVD FAQ
>http://www.dvddemystified.com/dvdfaq.html

Thanks Frank, much to study there. I'll get into it tomorrow.

Please see my detailed IsoBuster test results in my other thread, 'Is
Nero Express ruining my DVD-RWs?'

--
Terry, West Sussex, UK
Wed 5 October 2005, 22:41 UK time

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