Posted by George Hammond on 10/11/05 05:21

On Tue, 11 Oct 2005 03:43:53 GMT, Gary Eickmeier
<geickmei@tampabay.rr.com> wrote:

>
>
>riplin@Azonic.co.nz wrote:
>
>>>The INVISIBILITY comes in when you flash a SINGLE frame at a
>>>person which is SHORTER than 1/15 of a second.... WITHOUT
>>>following it up with another,
>>
>>
>> And that is where you fall completely into the crapper.
>>
>> Single very short flashes of light __CAN__ be seen. Ones considerably
>> shorter than 1/15th sec.
>>
>> Easy test, get a simple manual camera, open the back, set the shutter
>> to 1/30th and aperture fully open and then looking through the lens
>> fire off the camera.
>>
>> There will be a single image available that lasts 1/30sec. You __WILL__
>> see the flash of light as the shutter opens and closes, you may even be
>> able to recognise an object that the camera is pointing at, you
>> certainly will see it. I certainly can.
>>
>> Now set the speed to 1/125 and 1/250 and faster until you can only make
>> out that there is a flash of light. You may need to point the camera
>> at a good light source such as a 100watt bulb as the speed goes above
>> 1/500sec. 1/2000 sec can still be seen.
>>
>> This is an experiment that _anyone_ can do, one that actually works,
>> and is __PROOF__ that you are a moron.
>>
>> And children can do it too. I had a Brownie 128 camera as a kid that I
>> did this with, it worked fine then, it works now.
>
>Pretty good.
>


>[Eickmeier]
>When I was a kid, I made flip book cartoons that had greater frame rates
>than George thinks we can see.
>Gary Eickmeier

[Hammond]
Gary, you still don't understand the problem:


OF COURSE.... if the frame rate is faster than the persons
PFF, all those additional frames are INVISBLE to the person.
I.e., they have no effect on him... he is not conscious of them,
or to put it short, he doesn't "see" them.

If the video is playing at 500,000 frames per second... the avg.
person STILL only sees 15 pictures per second. In other words,
every 33,333 frames register on his consciousness as ONE PICTURE.

That "one picture" is an average of 33,333 frames.

the basic principle is that it takes 1/15 of a second for a "picture"
to register on the person's consciousness..... irregardless of
what the frame rate of what he's watching actually is.





>>
>> The INVISIBILITY comes in when you flash a SINGLE frame at a
>> person which is SHORTER than 1/15 of a second.... WITHOUT
>> following it up with another, and another, and another of the
>> same frames..... so there IS NO "bunch of frames" that his
>> brain can CLUMP TOGETHER to make a 1/15 of a second picture.
>

>Then we wouldn't be able to see any video or movie, because they are all
>composed of individual frames of shorter duration than 1/15th, and they
>are all individual frames which are NOT followed up by more identical ones.

[Hammond]
Gary.... you see EVERY MOVIE "as if" it were playing at 15 frames/sec,
IRREGARDLESS of what speed it is actually playing at.

This was proved DECADES AGO when they made "silent movies".
All silent movies were shot at 16 frames/sec... BECAUSE it was
discovered that this was the average PFF of the entire human
population.

1. They only bumped the rate up to 24 frames/sec when talkies
came in so as to keep the SOUND TRACK ferom warbling.

2. Then they bumped the frame rate up to 30 frames per
second when t.v. came in because 30 Hz is 1/2 of the
60 Hz power line frequency, making it convenient.

3. However, the HUMAN BRAIN hasn't changed since Thomas
Edison's day, and therefore REMAINS capable of only
seeing 16 frames/sec.

All frames BEYOND 16 frames/sec are INVISIBLE to the avg. person.

That DOESN'T MEAN a "wholoe movie" is going to become invisble if you
stick in more frames per second.... it simply means the additional
FRAMES will be invisble..... they are UNECESSARY.... but may be
CONVENIENT so as to keep the sound track from warbling... or make it
more compatible with the 60 cycle power.. or some other reason...
for instance preventing jagged edges when using high panning speeds
in video games etc. etc.

HOWEVER.... all this also points out that you CAN MAKE a movie
that is VISIBLE to someone with a HI-PFF, that will actually be
INVISBLE to someone with a LO-PFF.

As I have pointed out, all you have to do is DELETE frames from
a regular movie, so that the movie consists of 1/15 second
SPURTS.... separated by say 1/10 second spurts. That way,
the HI-PFF person (the adult) will "see a movie" while the
LO-PFF person WON'T.

the folowing is an example of such a movie made out of an ordinary
30 fps video sequence:

For instance, using ordinary 30 frames/second video,
I predict that the following video clip will be a movie
that will be VISIBLE to an adult, and INVISIBE to a
kid of 5 years old:


01|02|...|...|...|...|07|08|...|...|...|...|13|14|...|...|...|...|19|20|...|..|...|...|25|26|...|...|...|...|-------repeat10times------>

(NOTE: this is 1-second of a standard video, to make
the movie clip simply repeat it ten times to make a 10
second vido clip)

NOTE:

----->|...|<------ = 1/30 of a second (one frame)

----->|19|20|<----- = 1/15 of a second (2 frames)

----->|...|...|...|...|<------ = 1/7.5 of a second (4 frames)

The numbered frames are frames from an actual REAL MOVIE video, while
the |...| frames are BLANK (light gray) frames.

Remember, 2 frames is 2(1/30) = 1/15 of a second, so the ADULT
should see the numbered frames. The 4 repeated |...| frames take
1/7.5 seconds, so the kid can see those, but he cannot see the double
numbered frames.

So it is clear to me that the above sequence will be a VISIBLE MOVIE
to an adult...... but will be an INVISIBLE MOVIE to a 5 year old
kid............ and this constitutes a PROOF that there is an
INVISBLE WORLD which more fully GROWN people can SEE, but
which less fully GROWN people CAN'T SEE.


>
>Gary Eickmeier

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